Fiction Fans

Ninth Life by Stark Holborn

• Episode 151

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Your hosts read Ninth Life by Stark Holborn, the third book in what may or may not be a trilogy, they actually have no idea. They talk about the difficulties of year-long gaps before reading a sequel, debate what an epistolary novel is, and look up the definition for 2nd person POV. Lilly also spills the tea about a gossip-themed Pet Peeve.


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Thanks to the following musicians for the use of their songs:

- Amarià for the use of “Sérénade à Notre Dame de Paris”
- Josh Woodward for the use of “Electric Sunrise”

Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License



Lilly:

Hello and welcome to Fiction Fans, a podcast where we read books and other words, too. I'm Lily,

Sara:

And I'm Sarah.

Lilly:

and tonight we will be discussing Nine Lives. No, Ninth Life.

Sara:

Yes. Nightlife by Star Colborne.

Lilly:

Her name is Nine Lives, but the book is called Ninth Life.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

In my defense. Holy shit, I love this book and this series so much.

Sara:

Oh, this book was excellent. We do have a couple of intro questions to get through before we start talking about it.

Lilly:

Yeah, I'm seriously considering making my good thing reading this book.

Sara:

It's so good. It was, it was excellent.

Lilly:

I'm not going to use it as my good thing because that's silly, but like, it's up there.

Sara:

Yeah. I would say this is one of my favorite books that we've read for the podcast this year.

Lilly:

Absolutely. I mean, this series is probably in my top ten at this point. If we were going to redo our top tens.

Sara:

Hmm, which I think we should, because I think it'd be interesting to see how that changes.

Lilly:

read a lot more books since then.

Sara:

That's very true. We both have.

Lilly:

Anyway, anyway, what's your good thing? What's something great that happened recently is the correct question, sorry.

Sara:

Something great that happened is I went on another backpacking trip with my father. It was slightly longer. It went really, really well. And just, yeah, it was a great trip.

Lilly:

Fantastic! In your home now, you've showered, you've pet the dogs.

Sara:

I did consider making my good thing showering after getting back from the trip. Four days in the wilderness, because feeling finally clean is such a nice feeling. But the whole, yeah, the whole trip in general.

Lilly:

It's really funny how there is that tipping point in camping, where it's like, Yeah, I'm gross, but it's fine, because I'm camping! And then the second you get into the car to leave, you're like, Ugh!

Sara:

Yeah, I mean, for me, it's less, I'm in the wilderness, so it's fine. It's, I'm in the wilderness, so I can ignore how gross it is. Washing all that dirt off. Boy, that's nice.

Lilly:

So, my good thing is that past Lily, Solved a problem that I completely forgot about and proceeded to struggle with for like a week and then was like wait I've already fixed this

Sara:

Go past Lily.

Lilly:

I bought a little bottle of perfume, like essential oils perfume. Um, I'm not drinking it.

Sara:

I didn't think that was an option.

Lilly:

It depends on who you ask.

Sara:

Terrifying.

Lilly:

I've just been doing, like, you know, you take the lid off, and it's just a little open bottle top, and you put your wrist over it, and turn it upside down, and a little bit gets on your wrist. And if you don't, you know, spill a bunch on the floor, then it's fine. Unfortunately, I have been doing that. For the last, like, I would say 4 out of the last 5 days, there was some kind of disaster involved.

Sara:

Oh no.

Lilly:

So, I was complaining about this, and then I realized, I bought a refillable, like, little roller perfume applicator. Before I had even gotten this perfume, like, I already had it. So, that was good, and now I'm not dumping perfume all over the floor every time I try to use it.

Sara:

Nice.

Lilly:

Very. Well, what are you drinking tonight?

Sara:

So I'm drinking Laphroaig because I think it's the closest thing I have in the house to the kind of rot gut that they drink on Factus.

Lilly:

I'm gonna tell everyone that you called Laphroaig Rock Gut.

Sara:

Oh sure, I mean, like, I will be the first, like, I love it, but I will be the first person to say that it tastes like, you know, drinking tarmac.

Lilly:

Really? I've never had it, so I don't I mean, I probably have had it, but was not impressed.

Sara:

Yes. Of all the whiskey that I like, I think this is one of the most acquired tastes.

Lilly:

Most whiskey you like is an acquired taste, so that's saying something.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

Well, I made weird, gross, healthy chocolate milk. Quote unquote healthy chocolate milk.

Sara:

Why is it weird and gross?

Lilly:

Because it was healthy. I feel like that's self explanatory.

Sara:

What makes it healthy?

Lilly:

It's Unflavored protein powder and sugar free chocolate syrup.

Sara:

Why would you do such a thing?

Lilly:

Because it was all there was in the house that wasn't hot chocolate mix, and I wasn't confident that I would be able to mix that in with cold liquid and have it dissolve correctly. And it's too hot for hot chocolate.

Sara:

I guess that's fair, but also that, I'm sorry, that sounds terrible.

Lilly:

It, uh, it tastes like chemicals. Not disgusting chemicals, but definitely not like chocolate. I did this to myself.

Sara:

You did?

Lilly:

Sarah, have you read anything good lately?

Sara:

Let's see. I had a lot of time to do reading, on the backpacking trip because we would go to bed or we would get to the campsite, you know, maybe 630, have dinner, 730, then there's nothing else to do, really. So I did a lot of reading. I finished Chaingang All Stars, which I think I've talked about before.

Lilly:

That one was the one that was a lot, right?

Sara:

Heavy. Yeah, very heavy. And I kind of struggled a little bit with the middle, not because of anything wrong with the book, but because of, like, my own anxieties as a reader. One of the characters was keeping something from another character and that's the kind of thing that makes me anxious because I'm like, how is it going to go wrong? But they talk about it eventually. And it ended up being a really, really good book. I really liked the way that the author used footnotes. So the book is about. This kind of dystopian society, well, I don't know if it's entirely dystopian, but the bit that the book focuses on is definitely dystopian, where prisoners are basically given the opportunity to compete in murder games. like one on one murder games. And if they win enough times, then they can potentially become free. But I really liked the way the author used some of the footnotes and scenes in the book to comment on actual real world deaths or atrocities that happen within our own prison system. I thought that was a really, like, powerful way of doing it. So yes, excellent book. I'm not sure I would reread it, but it was really good.

Lilly:

I have Hobbit fan fiction, which is never a good use of time.

Sara:

Fan fiction is always a great use of time.

Lilly:

It was very fun though. Someone recommended a fic on Reddit, as they're like, Every time I finish watching the movies, like, I have to immediately go and read this piece. And so obviously, with a recommendation like that, I had to.

Sara:

Is it Thorin Bilbo?

Lilly:

This specific one is a sort of shorter, you know, fix it, everyone lives, nobody dies, with a good chunk of romance. But it was very cool because I'd actually read it before. So I was like, oh, yay.

Sara:

That's always a fun feeling.

Lilly:

Yeah. And then it's by the same author who wrote The Mushroom Mines, which is a very long collection that I've read before. But after I'd read that one, I was like, well, well, I'm here. Let's start this 200, 000 word journey.

Sara:

I'm impressed that you're reading something that's that long, because normally you're not a long, thick reader.

Lilly:

I'm not. But if the author has written other short stuff that I like, then I'm willing to give it a chance.

Sara:

That's fair.

Lilly:

And this one I know is good because I've read it before, so.

Sara:

Yes, that, that helps.

Lilly:

Anyway, so that was fun.

Sara:

Nice.

Lilly:

Very entirely out of tone, though, for what we're talking about tonight.

Sara:

Yes, this is true. The Hobbit and Hobbit fanfiction is very different from Nightlife.

Lilly:

In fact, I would say maybe, if you were trying to describe this book, I would say, Imagine Thorin Bilbo Fluff, and then just like the opposite of that. Which is not a useful way to describe a book at all, but it would be funny.

Sara:

It would be funny. It's not useful, but it would be funny. So Nightlife is the third book. I don't actually know what the series is called.

Lilly:

I think it's called the Factus. trilogy or something to that effect. Factus being the planet where the first two books entirely took place, or almost entirely took place, and it does show up in this book as well.

Sara:

Yeah. But this is book three. It follows a different character than the first two books did. The first two books followed Tenlo, and this is more about Gabby Ortiz, who shows up in the first two books, but is not the main character.

Lilly:

She is not the point of view character, however. That would be Have Mercy Grey, and we'll talk later about who the main character slash protagonist is.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

thought it was very interesting, you know, Tenloh is from the perspective of Ten, which I had struggled with at the beginning, but got over it because it's very good. And the vibe is so very different from Tenloh and Hell's Eight, the first two books, which we are absolutely going to spoil in this conversation.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

And I think part of that is because Ten starts out already a certified badass, whereas Have, it's almost a coming of age story for them.

Sara:

In some respects, yes.

Lilly:

Okay, their parts of the book are almost a coming of age story for them. There's quite a bit of the book that's not about them, even if it's minorly from their perspective.

Sara:

Yeah, I mean, I don't know if I would necessarily say that their story is the coming of age, but they do,

Lilly:

They sure do grow up fast.

Sara:

they do become, I think, a lot more competent and confident in themselves.

Lilly:

Worldly,

Sara:

Yeah, worldly. Which makes sense, because at the beginning of the book they'd never left their moon or wherever it is that they are.

Lilly:

JP,

Sara:

And then by the end, like, they're all over the place. Yes. But I also think that part of the reason why the vibe is different is just the format of the book. Like, the first two books are much more straightforward and linear, whereas this, like, the premise is that there's,

Lilly:

an archivist.

Sara:

yeah, this, this researcher or archivist who is looking through these historical documents that are detailing the events of the book. And so you have these different layers of story.

Lilly:

And a large part of it is the testimony of Have Mercy Gray, in which they are telling the story, you know, from their perspective. And then they're telling the story that Nine was telling them. So it's like a story about a story being told about a story. It's nuts. This book is so good.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

As much as the vibes are different, it's definitely the same genre. It's not like a departure from Tenlo and Hell's Eight.

Sara:

Right, like, it feels like part of the series. It's not disconnected in that way.

Lilly:

Yeah. Ooh! This is sci fi!

Sara:

It is very sci fi.

Lilly:

This book? Now this book is science fiction.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

The whole series is. It's so good. It's the really fun, like, space western that is just, in this case, done excellently.

Sara:

Yeah. I would say that Ninth Life might be my favorite in the trilogy, though.

Lilly:

I could see that. I really love Ten, so The stories that followed her, I also really enjoyed. But, I mean, this was probably the best book in the series.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

Do you think If you went and re read them now, it would be, like, a really different experience having read Ninth Life.

Sara:

I think I would be a little less confused at points, but that might also be because I'd be reading them all at once, presumably, and We read all of them for the podcast, so we read, I think, basically one a year, right? Like,

Lilly:

we've also read them when they came out, and unfortunately, that means

Sara:

so basically one a year, with lots of books in between and no time to reread the previous books. So it does mean that sometimes I had trouble following along with what was happening. Or, like, character backgrounds, because I was like, I know this was covered, but I don't actually remember it because it was covered in a previous book. But I think I felt that way more about Hell's Eight than I did about Ninth Life.

Lilly:

Yeah, also, because HALF is very much thrown into this with no background knowledge, it doesn't feel as bad that I didn't remember stuff, because HALF doesn't know either, so it's fine.

Sara:

Yeah, we are spending a lot of time in the mind of a character who doesn't know all of these little nuances about Gabi or about the people that Gabi has spent time with.

Lilly:

I will say, I fucking love epistolary novels. It's one of my favorite formats.

Sara:

So I loved the format of this book. Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely loved it. I also love epistolary novels. I'm not sure if I would consider this an epistolary novel because it's not letters.

Lilly:

Is that necessary? I thought that was just, like, one kind.

Sara:

My understanding was that it was letters, and I think that that's where the name epistolary comes from.

Lilly:

Well, sure. That's where the name comes from. But, I don't know. Apparently, Carrie by Stephen King is considered an epistolary novel.

Sara:

I've never,

Lilly:

A story told through newspaper clippings, magazine articles, letters, and book excerpts. I also have not read Carrie.

Sara:

yeah.

Lilly:

But if that's an epistolary novel, this is an epistolary novel. Well,

Sara:

but it does say that there are letters in there.

Lilly:

so what's your definition of a letter?

Sara:

Something that is written. Uh,

Lilly:

Because then Idrissy Blake's work could be considered a letter.

Sara:

I guess. So, when I think of epistolary letters, I think more of two characters writing to each other. Now, I don't know how accurate that really is to the definition, to be fair.

Lilly:

That's definitely not necessary because I found the definition over here. A monologic epistolary novel is made up of letters from only one person, and you have described a dialogic epistolary novel, which is made up of letters of two characters.

Sara:

Okay.

Lilly:

And then polylogic made up of the letters of three or more characters.

Sara:

I guess I have a very narrow definition of a pistillary novel then.

Lilly:

And I mean, I think, I would accept the argument that two characters writing to each other is the purest form. But I mean, if this, a collection of, like, news clippings and journal excerpts and transcribed testimony isn't an epistolary, Then what is it? Like, there's not a better word for it.

Sara:

There's not a better word for it, but it still is not what I think of when I think of a pistillary. Which, that could be a me problem, I'm willing to admit.

Lilly:

I mean, that's fine. It doesn't have to be your exemplar.

Sara:

Yeah. Haha.

Lilly:

But that doesn't make it not one.

Sara:

That's true. It doesn't necessarily. I, I just don't want to accept it as one because it doesn't fit in my very narrow definition.

Lilly:

It's so funny, I am usually so picky about perspective for prose, which we were going back and looking at our notes for Tenlo and I struggled a lot with that in the beginning of that book, despite loving it immensely. And I didn't even, like, pick up that Grey's testimony, Have Mercy Grey's testimony, was in second person until, like, halfway through.

Sara:

Okay, is it in second person though? If it's have mercy, is the point of view person using the I pronoun directing it at someone? Because Gabby is always the you. It's not the reader. Who is the, the you.

Lilly:

Okay, you're right. Yeah, the reader isn't you, and I guess that is, that does seem like a necessary aspect. I think the fact that it is all internally consistent, like, with the universe and Have Mercy isn't just talking to the reader for some reason. They're talking to, you know, Gabi. The you has a purpose. Even their testimony is given context for why it exists and why it has been collected. Goes so far, for me also, for not disliking first person perspective.

Sara:

Yeah. I mean, so the bits that we read as the reader, we're given to understand that the researcher Blake has edited them a little bit for content and clarity. And so some of that. Might be, what we're reading is not necessarily what Hav put down on the page, but presumably it's pretty close. But it also definitely does have a purpose, like, we're not in Hav's head as they're doing these things. This is something that Hav wrote down.

Lilly:

Yeah, I'm not sitting there going, How am I reading this? How has this information been transmitted?

Sara:

Right. You already know.

Lilly:

Yeah. Oh, you know, Blake also writes in second person. Basically, this book is about a bunch of people getting really obsessed with Gabi.

Sara:

Blake doesn't write in second person, though.

Lilly:

There's a lot of yous directed at Gabi.

Sara:

Okay, but that's, that's not writing in second person.

Lilly:

no, you're right, we already established that. So, like how Hav is talking to Gabi in their testimony, Blake is also talking to Gabi in their journal entries.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

Basically, everyone loves Gabi. And not romantically, but like, obsession devoting their life to her. Willing to die for her.

Sara:

Yes, everyone is obsessed with Gabi for different reasons.

Lilly:

I did really love in Blake. the archivist who has not only pulled all of this information together, but also writes journal entries about their journey of trying to find all the pieces, which was really enjoyable. But their whole plot line has a really strong theme of like, trying to discover truth, especially when it's buried under, you know, all of this propaganda, fake news, and even people who didn't really understand what they were seeing trying to make sense of it. And that was a really enjoyable plot line. It's a little stressful.

Sara:

Yeah, I really liked watching Blake tug on all of these different disparate threads trying to figure out Gabi's story and coming up against roadblocks and kind of getting paranoid about the roadblocks and then ultimately putting all of the pieces together, you know, at the very end.

Lilly:

And there's a few times, I don't think this is a spoiler, Blake is like kind of shocked and upset because in the story, in Have Mercy's Testimony, they're telling the story of Gabby telling her life story, and then there are a few points where Gabby says, And Blake, that's important, make sure to write that part down. And at the beginning, Blake is like, Clearly she meant someone else, right?

Sara:

What the actual fuck is going on here?

Lilly:

Ugh, so good.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

How much do you think we really missed out on this by not rereading the first two books?

Sara:

So I feel like there were definitely things that I would have picked up on faster if we had reread the first two books, like characters that I would have remembered without needing a little bit more of an introduction. But on the whole, because this does take place, you know, like 40 years after the events of the first two books, and it does follow a different main character. Even though, of course, Gabi's in the first two books, I thought it stood alone pretty well.

Lilly:

I don't think it stands alone. But I don't think I needed crystal clear memory of the first two books, which I think is what you meant.

Sara:

Yeah, I mean, I'm not necessarily going to recommend that people start the series with this book, right?

Lilly:

No, you definitely need to know what Ten went through. Because, I mean, she turns into basically a mythological being. Um, and it was, well, we'll talk about that in a little bit. But, you That's, it happens in Hell's Eight, so that's not a spoiler for this book. But, I think when you hear about her, and how other people talk about her, versus how Gabi talks about her, not knowing her story would make that experience very different. You don't need to remember the particulars of it.

Sara:

I think that knowing her story helps, but I think that you could still enjoy this book without it.

Lilly:

Yeah, probably. It's a good book. But I don't think it would have the right impact.

Sara:

Right, but, but in that respect, it does stand alone.

Lilly:

But why would you skip Tenlo and Hell's Eight?

Sara:

Again, I'm not necessarily recommending that you do,

Lilly:

Just that it's possible,

Sara:

just that it's possible. Like, I don't think that you could read Hell's Eight without having read Tenlo.

Lilly:

Absolutely, that's true.

Sara:

But I think that you could read Ninth Life and enjoy it without having read the first two books that said, why would you want to

Lilly:

Yeah, especially considering they are, you know, in the same world, in the same genres, there's the same themes of like survivalism and humanity scraping by. If you were gonna like Ninth Life, you would like Tenlo and Hell's Eight. So there's no reason to, I don't know. Sometimes series get wild and it's like, don't even bother with the first or second half. That's not what we're doing here. So then, I mean, obviously, who should read this book if you read Tenlo and Elsate? So this series, the, what I'm going to call the Factus series, even though I cannot find anything to back up why I think it's called that, so maybe I made it up. Okay, cool. I was right. Thank you.

Sara:

You were almost right.

Lilly:

If any factus was involved.

Sara:

Yeah. Sequence, not series, but.

Lilly:

So we were trying to find who should read Tenlo from our episode on Many Years Ago. And we found the blurb, Mad Max meets Firefly.

Sara:

Which I think remains accurate.

Lilly:

Yes. I also apparently said the line, if you want some like weird spiritual shit all mixed up in your pretty reasonable sci fi, get in on this. Which also remains accurate.

Sara:

Also remains accurate.

Lilly:

So I highly recommend everyone go read Tenlo and then be able to read the next two in a row, which we weren't able to do. But liked it anyway.

Sara:

We were not, but I think it is the mark of a good series where you're still such a fan of the book, even when you're like, I really should have reread the first couple of books.

Lilly:

Yeah. To avoid spoilers, skip to 43 44. But first, a word from our sponsors. You! You're our sponsors! Thank you to our patrons for making this podcast possible.

Sara:

If you support us on Patreon, you can find, um, show notes. Do we still post our show notes?

Lilly:

No.

Sara:

Okay, you can't find our show notes.

Lilly:

Those are top secret.

Sara:

But, you can find us playing a game of Shoot, Screw, or Marry with book characters from the books that we read. You can get exclusive episodes, and at our highest tier of support, you can even watch us record an exclusive episode, which may or may not be worth the money.

Lilly:

Our wonderful smiling faces, of course it is.

Sara:

Of course. You can hear all of our digressions,

Lilly:

Yes, we have some outtakes. I occasionally clip various animal noises that don't make it into the final cuts and make little compilations.

Sara:

of which there are a lot of animal noises.

Lilly:

Mm hmm. I mean, the double edged sword is that as our recording equipment has gotten better, the pet noises have decreased.

Sara:

Decreased or increased? There are less of them now?

Lilly:

They're more isolated.

Sara:

Okay. Because I would think that as our audio equipment gets better, you can hear for example, the pug snores more.

Lilly:

If the pug snores are loud enough to get picked up, they fucking get picked up. But these microphones have more directionality.

Sara:

Ah, that's true.

Lilly:

So if they're not, like, right up next to the microphone, we don't really hear it. And hey, nice microphones are another thing that our patrons have made possible for us, so

Sara:

Yes. Through your support we are able to host our website, host the podcast, buy equipment, buy books occasionally, although we would be buying the books anyway, so, I don't know if that really counts as a podcast expense.

Lilly:

No. Okay, we have to ask the question, who is the main character? I think there are three nominees, although I don't think there is an equal argument for all three. In any book, you have to consider, at least consider, the point of view characters. Now, yes, Watson is not the main character of Sherlock Holmes, in fact, by that argument. Well, actually, it's not named after Nine Lives because it's called Ninth Life, so it's not her name on the title of the book. Never mind.

Sara:

It's not her name, but it is still about her because it's about her ninth life.

Lilly:

There's also, is Idrissy correct? Idrissy Blake? I feel like that's correct. Idrissy.

Sara:

I'm going to be real honest, I read this book like five books ago, so some of the finer details have escaped my mind. But yes, it is Military Proctor Idrissi Blake.

Lilly:

And then Have Mercy Grey, the youth who finds themselves, well, trying to arrest Gabby, but

Sara:

Successfully arresting Gabi.

Lilly:

They had help. She was half dead.

Sara:

They did have help. She was half dead. That does not negate the fact that Hav did successfully arrest Gabi.

Lilly:

That's true. But then they end up saving each other's lives a lot. The development of their relationship was really sweet.

Sara:

Yeah, I liked seeing Hav grow from this. young kid who is basically just doing it because they need the money of Gabi's bounty to someone who has experience and respects Gabi for, like, all of her experience.

Lilly:

I mean, Blake is obviously not the main character, so we can just cut that one right at the beginning.

Sara:

But I love Blake's story! I want more Blake!

Lilly:

Okay, the fact that this book balances three different stories that are all revolving around Gabi, but are still different stories, and even if they don't all have equal stage time, They're still all very well developed, and I really loved all three of those characters.

Sara:

It didn't feel unbalanced, right? Like, you're right that they don't all get equal page time, but it feels like an appropriate breakdown.

Lilly:

I mean, Blake is basically just Except we also followed the deterioration of their relationship.

Sara:

And their, like, working life.

Lilly:

You called it paranoia earlier, which I think we had to because it was the non spoiler

Sara:

I, yeah, I,

Lilly:

But the fact that it ended up being completely justified, I mean, was obvious, but was also delightful.

Sara:

yes. Like, I loved, and I, I did call it paranoia because I was trying to not give away spoilers too much, but I loved seeing Blake realize that all of their research is being deleted. Intentionally, on purpose, by the higher ups, that they are being used as some kind of, like, sniffing dog to sniff out all of the remnants of Gabi that are in the archives, so that everything about her can be deleted.

Lilly:

Blake's realization, because their question throughout this project was, Who is trying to sabotage my research? And the realization that those very same people who assigned them that research, because the entire point of the project was just to discover the proof, not because they actually wanted a full report. And then them sending it to all of the news agencies at the very end was just like, Oh, incredible.

Sara:

was, it was so good. Semi unrelated, but I loved the radio clippings.

Lilly:

Oh, they were so smarmy, it was

Sara:

They were so, they were so smarmy. It was incredible. I was like, these are my favorite bits. I loved everything, but I loved those in particular. But okay, so for our second candidate for main character, obviously we have, have, have Mercy Gray, whose testimonies make up, I would say, the bulk of this book.

Lilly:

The deal they make with Gabby at the very beginning is, I will keep, well, Gabby says, I will keep you alive if you listen to my story and have kind of, you know, ah, I'm turning you in. And then obviously is in way over their head. because they are not a professional bounty hunter, and even if they were, Gabby is kind of the superhuman

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

It was really interesting to see, I mean, one of the main aspects of 10 low was that 10. Isn't the only person who can harness the power of the if demons? And I know they're not called demons, but that's still like the easiest way to talk about it. I'm just saying the ifs

Sara:

That sounds like a band.

Lilly:

is linguistically difficult, yeah. And so it was very interesting in this book seeing more people with that capability,

Sara:

Use them, yeah.

Lilly:

yeah. So that's, I mean, that's how Gabi has nine lives. Because she has used the probability machine that are the ifs to avoid nine deaths, basically. Although it has definitely caught up with her at this point. Argument for why have could be the main character. They go through the most character growth.

Sara:

Yes. I think that I would say that Hav is the main character, but the book is about Gabi.

Lilly:

Yeah, I would agree with that. Because even have Going through growth is about Gabi.

Sara:

Yeah, like, the entire action of the book revolves around Gabi, centers around Gabi, but I think that, like you say, Hav goes through the most growth. They're also the point of view character for most of it. They, Are the ones not doing the action, but like, recording everything? They're right there in the thick of things.

Lilly:

Except for the thick of things that is Nine Lives, Nine Lives. Nine lives is nine lives. Also a hard thing to say. I really loved how this book balanced, well, have storyline with Gabi's storyline, right? Like Gabi's past with Gabi's present, which is What she's sharing with Have Mercy, but this book balances Big Bad, capital B, Big Bad Which is the, you know, we have to save the world, the system is broken Politicians, not even politicians, but you know Capitalist hellscape, company owners are trying to destroy planets, huge conceptual things At the same time, we have the really, like, personal and intimate problems and conflicts that I would say are more around HALF's storyline. Like, we get Shockney, who's sort of a, not a gang leader, but basically a gang leader.

Sara:

think gang leader is not inaccurate.

Lilly:

A sanctioned gang, gang leader. Not a counterculture gang, which is what Nine Lives is part of. And I, because I always like those close stories, and so being able to have both of them at the same time made the, like, big, overarching, Gabi needs to destroy the, not, just, murder, destroy, what a weird word choice there. She needs to murder the head of the company who's trying to fuck up FACTIS and starve everybody.

Sara:

she's already murdered him.

Lilly:

Yeah, okay, but her story is about how Xiao Xi needs to.

Sara:

Yes. But even in her storyline, which does have Much bigger themes, I think, because she, in the scheme of this universe, she has more impact on things than have. I mean, she's just a larger figure, but even her storyline has some of those very personal lowercase B bad things and people.

Lilly:

Absolutely. I mean, the only reason why any of this has happening is because she decides to give a fuck about Factus. Random moon that no one else cares about.

Sara:

She's got friends on Factus. It's personal.

Lilly:

Oh yeah, and that's exactly it. It's personal. Like, they're the found family that we see her acquire in the first two books. are not really gone into here, except we know this woman will do anything for that stupid moon.

Sara:

I would say that they're mentioned, but obviously you don't really get their story that much.

Lilly:

Exactly, yeah. We just see people who she obviously cares about. And in this book, you just sort of accept that, okay, yeah, she cares about them. But having read the storyline of her growing to care about them, which I only vaguely remembered, made it so much more meaningful.

Sara:

Yes, agreed.

Lilly:

I do think I remember Tenlo better than Hellzate, and it was kind of a problem.

Sara:

It's funny, I think I remember Tenlo better than Halsey too.

Lilly:

I have a theory. Because when we read Hell's Eight, we had to recall Tenlo.

Sara:

Yeah, okay, I would believe that.

Lilly:

And so we have now thought about Tenlo twice, and Hell's Eight only the once.

Sara:

Yeah, I, yeah, I would, I would believe that. It's funny because there are some scenes from Hell's Eight that are very distinct in my head, but I couldn't necessarily tell you the plot of Hell's Eight.

Lilly:

Well, Hell's Eight also, I know we said that the first two are more linear, but Hell's Eight does have some crazy time skipping going on in the story, like, storytelling.

Sara:

Yeah, that's also very true.

Lilly:

With that, like, outpost that we're slowly finding out what happened to, and so there was definitely some complexity there that I think I would really like to reread, because I think I might figure out what's going on better. I mean, I got there. It was fine. It was enjoyable, but all three of these books have had an aspect of just buckle up, and you'll get there in the end. Ask questions, but they won't be answered right away.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

We got almost a farewell tour of characters in this book.

Sara:

We kind of did,

Lilly:

was almost like the series of cameos for everyone we've grown to know and love.

Sara:

but it didn't feel intrusive the way that that sometimes can, right? It felt like the characters were being introduced appropriately, and it just so happened that it was a farewell tour.

Lilly:

Well, and when Gabi is telling the story of, not her whole life, well, kind of her whole life, because she does start as a genetically engineered child soldier.

Sara:

Yeah, she skips over a lot of the early stuff, but she mentions it.

Lilly:

So it makes sense that she's going to mention all of the important people that she and we have met if it's the story of her life. So it's natural. It doesn't feel forced.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

I am still so mad, not actually mad, deeply upset about the relationship between Ten and Silas.

Sara:

Interesting.

Lilly:

The unresolved, not unresolved, but like, they don't really break up, but they kind of do, and it's just never good. There's no closure.

Sara:

Yeah, but it's, it's hard to have a relationship with basically a mythological figure.

Lilly:

Yeah, no, I know. It's good. That's why I downgraded it from mad. The romance reader in me is deeply upset.

Sara:

That's fair. That's fair.

Lilly:

No, it's well done. It's good. I feel like every time, or not every time, but in Hell's Eight I had the same experience. Where I was just like, da da da, reading about these badasses, okay. Oh fuck, that's right, Silas exists. Wait, hang on! There should be smooching!

Sara:

I wasn't mad about Silas's relationship or lack thereof in this book, but Gabi's relationship with, and I can't for the life of me remember the name,

Lilly:

Roof?

Sara:

yeah, that made me sad.

Lilly:

That was heartbreaking.

Sara:

so heartbreaking.

Lilly:

Oh my god. We also got a lot more of the edge in this book. Because we've seen it a little bit, but it's been very mysterious. And it's still very mysterious. But Gabi spends a What we find out is ten years in this sort of, like, liminal space, afterlife thing,

Sara:

Living with Roof, who's dead.

Lilly:

Uh, who died for her, who snuck into a, not a project, a mission to save her life and die in her stead, basically. Or not die in her stead, but like, sacrifice themselves so she would live. But I think, I think that means that she'll be able to go back, don't you?

Sara:

I hope so.

Lilly:

I think it's, it kind of implied that when she dies for real, because like, 10 kind of sneaks her in to the edge to hang out with Roof, right? That's not, that's not like how it's supposed to happen.

Sara:

I mean, yes, it is kind of implied, and I think that there is a hopeful aspect at the end of the book. Not in the sense that Gabi is going to live, because Gabi is definitely not going to live, but that Gabi might have some kind of content afterlife.

Lilly:

Her and 10 blowing themselves up together.

Sara:

Oh, my heart. I cried at the end of this book.

Lilly:

Oh, how can you not?

Sara:

I mean, like, I cry at the drop of a hat, but this book definitely turned on the waterworks.

Lilly:

Yeah, the like, the triumph of it. Like, they're going out with a bang and they know it.

Sara:

Yes. But, like, it's so bittersweet because you have that one brief moment of hope that they're all gonna get away and things are gonna turn out okay, but of course, like, Hopeborn's not gonna let us sit with that for very long.

Lilly:

Yeah, I mean, half Mercy gets away.

Sara:

It's not a depressing ending.

Lilly:

Yeah, it's definitely not like a, Everyone lives happily ever after.

Sara:

No, and that's, I just want my happy ever after for everyone that I care about.

Lilly:

Yeah, it Oh my god. I loved Ten so much in Tenlo and Hell's Eight, and like, being in her head, I eventually liked that part. But seeing her like, change from completely denying the ifs and her like, chance magic, I'm gonna call it that. That's also not exactly right, but it's not wrong.

Sara:

It's not wrong, it's close enough.

Lilly:

To embracing it, and then becoming a cult leader, and then becoming a mythological figure is not quite the right phrase. What am I looking for? Folklore? Like folklore legend? Folk legend. Is that a thing?

Sara:

Yeah,

Lilly:

Have I gotten there?

Sara:

yeah, I'd say she becomes a folk legend.

Lilly:

And of course we know that every word about her is true. Well, not every word, but the aspects that people are quickest to dismiss. It's like, yeah, she can walk the line between life and death. We've, we've seen her do it. Oh, and the Seekers are still such a cool I think I, in my heart of hearts, like Hellzate the best, because the Seekers are so heavy metal.

Sara:

I mean, the Seekers are very Uh, that's where I get the most Mad Max vibes, I think.

Lilly:

Mm. Scavenging body parts off of dead, or nearly dead, bodies to, like, help keep other people alive. I think that's the part that makes it not Edgelord y.

Sara:

Yeah, they're definitely not Edgelord. And they are, like you said, they are doing it in order to keep other people alive. And the people that they are taking organs from are either dead or, like, they're dead and they just don't know it yet.

Lilly:

Yeah, their goal is always to help first. So like, if they could save your life, they would do that. If they can't save your life, they will take all your blood and your skin and also some teeth. Maybe your eyes. Couple organs.

Sara:

And, you know, honestly, like, there's nothing wrong with that.

Lilly:

The ultimate recyclers.

Sara:

Yeah.

Lilly:

The, like, humanitarian aspect of it makes it interesting, and not just, like, Oh, the black market organ trade, or whatever. I love all of that so much, that I think Hells 8 will probably be, like, my personal favorite. Which is different from Like, looking at the series as a whole. Which, yeah, Ninth Life is obviously

Sara:

Well, yeah, I mean, there's the difference between which book do you like best and which book is the best. I think for me, both of those answers would be Ninth Life. It was my, I think it was the one that I had the most fun reading. And also I think it's the best. But a lot of that comes down to personal taste, too.

Lilly:

I mean, I loved it. And, you know, Ninth Life being the best out of Is Is this a trilogy? Is it done? It is, right? Or not necessarily?

Sara:

I'm not sure. I don't actually know.

Lilly:

I guess I could see other stories in this world. But I It's not I mean, ten died, we're pretty sure.

Sara:

Yeah, I don't think that there are more stories that could be told about Ten and Gabi.

Lilly:

If there were more stories in the FACTUS sequence I would probably personally consider them a separate series, just because it's gonna be about different people.

Sara:

Yes.

Lilly:

if it was about Half Mercy, it wouldn't feel the same, like the same story arc.

Sara:

Right. It would definitely feel like a separate series.

Lilly:

Yeah. Anyway, so for the final book in a trilogy, I've just decided that's what this is. For the sake of the argument, Honestly, for every book in this trilogy, for each one to have been better than the last, despite it already starting so high, it's fucking incredible.

Sara:

It is. I mean, Holborn does an amazing job with this series. Like we've said, this is one of our favorite books this year that we've read. So, yeah. Excellent. A Ten out of ten, no notes.

Lilly:

I'm borrowing trouble. Are you ready?

Sara:

Uh oh.

Lilly:

Next time we do a, like, top 10 books list, like, you can't pick a whole series. That's cheating. But I don't think I could pick Hell's Eight, because I think I would choose Ninth Life as the emblematic book to encapsulate the whole series.

Sara:

Hmm.

Lilly:

That's upsetting to me.

Sara:

I mean, you could just spend three of your ten slots on these books.

Lilly:

That might be a little dramatic. We'll see. We'll see how I'm feeling when we actually do it.

Sara:

Dramatic, maybe, but well within the realm of legality.

Lilly:

Yes. I learned something about myself while I was reading this book.

Sara:

What did you learn, Lily?

Lilly:

Apparently I really hate the word scuttlebutt.

Sara:

Interesting. What about it do you hate? Why do you hate it?

Lilly:

I don't know. It's used Blake, the archivist, uses it to describe how they're trying to get extra information about one of the events that they find an incomplete report about. And so they're looking for scuttlebutt. And I was like, no. What? Why? I

Sara:

I can't say that the word particularly bothers me.

Lilly:

think it's a really cute word. Maybe it just felt really out of place.

Sara:

It does feel kind of you know what it reminds me of?

Lilly:

A crab with a huge ass?

Sara:

I was gonna say a cuttlefish.

Lilly:

Mmm, also a cuttlefish with a huge ass. Does okay, is the word butt actually spelled like butt? Or is that just how I remember it?

Sara:

I think it actually is.

Lilly:

It is! Yeah, okay, I'm right.

Sara:

It is like, kind of a cute word.

Lilly:

And so I think, like, okay, apparently there's a beer brewery up here in Everett called Scuttlebutt Brewing, and if their logo is anything adorable and nautical, that's fine.

Sara:

I mean, it does have nautical origins.

Lilly:

Yeah, yeah, and that, like, totally fits into this world. It's just, scuttlebutt, I don't, I don't like it. There is no logical or justifiable reason for me to hate this word as much as I do.

Sara:

I'm sorry.

Lilly:

It just, like, completely took me out of it. I had to actually set the book down for a minute.

Sara:

Yeah, I think that's just an irrational distaste for the word.

Lilly:

Yeah, I, mm mm, didn't work for me.

Sara:

I had no problems with it.

Lilly:

Ugh. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Fiction Fans.

Sara:

Come disagree with us. We're on Twitter, TikTok at FictionFansPod. You can also email us at FictionFansPod at gmail. com.

Lilly:

If you enjoyed the episode, please rate and review on Spotify and Apple Podcasts, and follow us wherever your podcasts live.

Sara:

We also have a Patreon where you can support us and find exclusive episodes and a lot of other nonsense.

Lilly:

Thanks again for listening, and may your villains always be defeated.

Sara:

Bye.